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	<title>Comments on: Intel vs. AMD Update:  Skulltrail vs. Spider/3870 X2</title>
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	<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/</link>
	<description>Upgrade Your Lifestyle</description>
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		<title>By: Kristopher Gomez</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60177</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristopher Gomez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 09:06:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60177</guid>
		<description>I am running a full Spider system right now, having a K9A2 Platinum (AMD 790FX Chipset), a Phenom 9500 processor and a Sapphire 3850 Ultimate GPU. Although it&#039;s not the most powerful of gaming rigs or of the Spider platforms in general, I&#039;m loving it.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I run Vista Premium x64, and everything runs so very smoothly. I -am- on of the &quot;Science Geeks&quot; that runs SETI/Einstien/QMC/TANPAKU @Home on a constant basis; and sometimes, even when I&#039;m playing games.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At a given time, all 4 of these projects are running at the same time, and often, each &quot;project&quot; is running multiple computations. This is all ignoring the &quot;basic&quot; background tasks - Outlook 2007, Google Desktop, etc.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Typically, there&#039;s no noticable decline in performance when all of these processes are running. By the way, I have 4GB of memory; just for referance.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When there are slow-downs, it usually is caused by the one bottleneck of 90% of computers: the hard drive(s).&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
It would appear that Crysis uses all 4 processors, because each only peak at 23% usage when playing. Usually, I set the Crysis process for affinity of only 2 cores. The system (maybe AMD drivers, maybe Vista) seems to distribute the rest of the workload pretty well.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
And the coup-de-gras: My ATI card has an DVI-HDMI adapter, and the sound is routed through that as well.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I could not be more impressed with the performance of my Spider. With Tabbed Browsing running all sorts of web content (such as YouTube, etc.), I can absolutely see how Quad-Core CPUs can benefit the &quot;average user&quot;. Keep in mind, also, Windows Vista - at least Ultimate - has MANY no-cert-needed home server applications. WinAmp is pushing their new Orb-based Web-to-Home music system, and many other &quot;end user&quot; applications are moving in quite the same direction... none of which are geared toward &quot;Power Users&quot;.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Don&#039;t knock it until you try it. It&#039;s really something else. AMD calls this Phenom a &quot;9500+&quot; for a reason - it&#039;s 4-2.2GHz processors, each sharing nearly-evenly distributed work.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
As far as cost goes... This system costed me about $1500. And that&#039;s generous, because I&#039;m estimating the addition of HDD&#039;s, Optical Drives, keyboard, mouse, etc. - all of which I already had. The Proc+MoBo+Mem+VGA=$1050.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I built it myself, so I also didn&#039;t pay for labor.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
- Kris</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am running a full Spider system right now, having a K9A2 Platinum (AMD 790FX Chipset), a Phenom 9500 processor and a Sapphire 3850 Ultimate GPU. Although it&#039;s not the most powerful of gaming rigs or of the Spider platforms in general, I&#039;m loving it.</p>
<p>I run Vista Premium x64, and everything runs so very smoothly. I -am- on of the &#8220;Science Geeks&#8221; that runs SETI/Einstien/QMC/TANPAKU @Home on a constant basis; and sometimes, even when I&#039;m playing games.</p>
<p>At a given time, all 4 of these projects are running at the same time, and often, each &#8220;project&#8221; is running multiple computations. This is all ignoring the &#8220;basic&#8221; background tasks &#8211; Outlook 2007, Google Desktop, etc.</p>
<p>Typically, there&#039;s no noticable decline in performance when all of these processes are running. By the way, I have 4GB of memory; just for referance.</p>
<p>When there are slow-downs, it usually is caused by the one bottleneck of 90% of computers: the hard drive(s).</p>
<p>It would appear that Crysis uses all 4 processors, because each only peak at 23% usage when playing. Usually, I set the Crysis process for affinity of only 2 cores. The system (maybe AMD drivers, maybe Vista) seems to distribute the rest of the workload pretty well.</p>
<p>And the coup-de-gras: My ATI card has an DVI-HDMI adapter, and the sound is routed through that as well.</p>
<p>I could not be more impressed with the performance of my Spider. With Tabbed Browsing running all sorts of web content (such as YouTube, etc.), I can absolutely see how Quad-Core CPUs can benefit the &#8220;average user&#8221;. Keep in mind, also, Windows Vista &#8211; at least Ultimate &#8211; has MANY no-cert-needed home server applications. WinAmp is pushing their new Orb-based Web-to-Home music system, and many other &#8220;end user&#8221; applications are moving in quite the same direction&#8230; none of which are geared toward &#8220;Power Users&#8221;.</p>
<p>Don&#039;t knock it until you try it. It&#039;s really something else. AMD calls this Phenom a &#8220;9500+&#8221; for a reason &#8211; it&#039;s 4-2.2GHz processors, each sharing nearly-evenly distributed work.</p>
<p>As far as cost goes&#8230; This system costed me about $1500. And that&#039;s generous, because I&#039;m estimating the addition of HDD&#039;s, Optical Drives, keyboard, mouse, etc. &#8211; all of which I already had. The Proc+MoBo+Mem+VGA=$1050.</p>
<p>I built it myself, so I also didn&#039;t pay for labor.</p>
<p>- Kris</p>
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		<title>By: Kristopher Gomez</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60176</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristopher Gomez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 08:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60176</guid>
		<description>I am running a full Spider system right now, having a K9A2 Platinum (AMD 790FX Chipset), a Phenom 9500 processor and a Sapphire 3850 Ultimate GPU. Although it&#039;s not the most powerful of gaming rigs or of the Spider platforms in general, I&#039;m loving it.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
I run Vista Premium x64, and everything runs so very smoothly. I -am- on of the &quot;Science Geeks&quot; that runs SETI/Einstien/QMC/TANPAKU @Home on a constant basis; and sometimes, even when I&#039;m playing games.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
At a given time, all 4 of these projects are running at the same time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am running a full Spider system right now, having a K9A2 Platinum (AMD 790FX Chipset), a Phenom 9500 processor and a Sapphire 3850 Ultimate GPU. Although it&#039;s not the most powerful of gaming rigs or of the Spider platforms in general, I&#039;m loving it.</p>
<p>I run Vista Premium x64, and everything runs so very smoothly. I -am- on of the &#8220;Science Geeks&#8221; that runs SETI/Einstien/QMC/TANPAKU @Home on a constant basis; and sometimes, even when I&#039;m playing games.</p>
<p>At a given time, all 4 of these projects are running at the same time.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Howard</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60175</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Howard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:10:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60175</guid>
		<description>General consumers right now don&#039;t have a need for more than 2 cores. Plus, the fact that the majority of software out there might not utilize multiple cores make it a useless as well.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Powerusers are not the norm.  Most people do not run servers at home.  And spending extra money just so you can run SETI@home seems like a waste as well.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>General consumers right now don&#039;t have a need for more than 2 cores. Plus, the fact that the majority of software out there might not utilize multiple cores make it a useless as well.</p>
<p>Powerusers are not the norm.  Most people do not run servers at home.  And spending extra money just so you can run SETI@home seems like a waste as well.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Ari</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60174</link>
		<dc:creator>Ari</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 08:46:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60174</guid>
		<description>Donald,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Did you read Robs comment?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&quot;Photo and video editing software, as well as some transcoding products, and a couple of games will use multi-core right now. I expect this will change by the end of the year. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Right now one of the benefits is that if a background process (anti-virus for instance) kicks off it may have less impact on what you are doing on one of these systems. &quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
He said basically what you just said, so he didn&#039;t miss anything.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
For the general consumer though, 4-8 cores is a waste of money and nothing but marketing hype.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
General consumers&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
1) Probably will not have a home media server (this is changing slowly though)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
2) Do not even know what virtualization is&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
4) Do not know what SETI at home is</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Donald,</p>
<p>Did you read Robs comment?</p>
<p>&#8220;Photo and video editing software, as well as some transcoding products, and a couple of games will use multi-core right now. I expect this will change by the end of the year. </p>
<p>Right now one of the benefits is that if a background process (anti-virus for instance) kicks off it may have less impact on what you are doing on one of these systems. &#8220;</p>
<p>He said basically what you just said, so he didn&#039;t miss anything.</p>
<p>For the general consumer though, 4-8 cores is a waste of money and nothing but marketing hype.</p>
<p>General consumers</p>
<p>1) Probably will not have a home media server (this is changing slowly though)</p>
<p>2) Do not even know what virtualization is</p>
<p>4) Do not know what SETI at home is</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Donald A. Tevault</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60173</link>
		<dc:creator>Donald A. Tevault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2008 05:44:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60173</guid>
		<description>Rob,&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
You tech writers keep missing part of the point of having multi-core processors.  There are several ways in which a consumer can take advantage of either four or eight cores, even without multi-threaded software.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
1. Power users, like me, like to have many applications open at once.  The more cores, the merrier, in these situations.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
2. A server for home or small business could take advantage of multiple cores, since a  lot of processes would be going on at once.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
3. For virtualization, again, the more cores, the merrier.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
4. Science geeks could run more instances of distributed computing apps at once.  (e.g., Einstein@Home or SETI@Home.)&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
So, really, there&#039;s no need to wait for specialized, multi-threaded software in order to benefit from multi-core processors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rob,</p>
<p>You tech writers keep missing part of the point of having multi-core processors.  There are several ways in which a consumer can take advantage of either four or eight cores, even without multi-threaded software.</p>
<p>1. Power users, like me, like to have many applications open at once.  The more cores, the merrier, in these situations.</p>
<p>2. A server for home or small business could take advantage of multiple cores, since a  lot of processes would be going on at once.</p>
<p>3. For virtualization, again, the more cores, the merrier.</p>
<p>4. Science geeks could run more instances of distributed computing apps at once.  (e.g., Einstein@Home or SETI@Home.)</p>
<p>So, really, there&#039;s no need to wait for specialized, multi-threaded software in order to benefit from multi-core processors.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Ryan Mahood</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60171</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan Mahood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 20:21:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60171</guid>
		<description>Perhaps you are overlooking the very Reality of the GPU(Graphics Processing Market); compatibility. Crossfire (the use of multiple ATI cards) is possible on NOT ONLY ATI/AMD chipsets, but also on Intel Chipsets. As a result Motherboards with Intel Chipsets can, and have been running Crossfire for well over two years now. Intel isn&#039;t going to be left behind on the graphics front either. Larrabee is Intel&#039;s upcoming graphics solution, and albeit very hush-hush we know that it will compete directly against nVidia and AMD.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps you are overlooking the very Reality of the GPU(Graphics Processing Market); compatibility. Crossfire (the use of multiple ATI cards) is possible on NOT ONLY ATI/AMD chipsets, but also on Intel Chipsets. As a result Motherboards with Intel Chipsets can, and have been running Crossfire for well over two years now. Intel isn&#039;t going to be left behind on the graphics front either. Larrabee is Intel&#039;s upcoming graphics solution, and albeit very hush-hush we know that it will compete directly against nVidia and AMD.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Rob Enderle</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60172</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Enderle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 15:35:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60172</guid>
		<description>Photo and video editing software, as well as some transcoding products, and a couple of games will use multi-core right now.   I expect this will change by the end of the year.  &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Right now one of the benefits is that if a background process (anti-virus for instance) kicks off it may have less impact on what you are doing on one of these systems. &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Both Intel and AMD are focusing on power conservation and future systems will power down their cores more aggressivly.   The X2 card is actually rather impressive in this regard and appears to drop into a low power state when you aren&#039;t pushing it.   &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Generally the focus on these high end boxes has been more focused on raw performance, but, like you I&#039;d like to see this change because I&#039;d like to stop being the major funding source for my power company.  &lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Over the next few weeks I&#039;ll be seeing what products actually make use of this performance and will write up what I find.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Photo and video editing software, as well as some transcoding products, and a couple of games will use multi-core right now.   I expect this will change by the end of the year.  </p>
<p>Right now one of the benefits is that if a background process (anti-virus for instance) kicks off it may have less impact on what you are doing on one of these systems. </p>
<p>Both Intel and AMD are focusing on power conservation and future systems will power down their cores more aggressivly.   The X2 card is actually rather impressive in this regard and appears to drop into a low power state when you aren&#039;t pushing it.   </p>
<p>Generally the focus on these high end boxes has been more focused on raw performance, but, like you I&#039;d like to see this change because I&#039;d like to stop being the major funding source for my power company.  </p>
<p>Over the next few weeks I&#039;ll be seeing what products actually make use of this performance and will write up what I find.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Ian Bell</title>
		<link>http://www.digitaltrends.com/talk-backs/intel-vs-amd-update-skulltrail-vs-spider3870-x2/#comment-60170</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 09:45:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-60170</guid>
		<description>Both of these systems sounds pretty awesome. They are definately overkill though. I do not know of a single game that would take advantage of 4 cores, let alone 8 - so what&#039;s the point here from a gaming perspective? Does Photoshop on Vista take advantage of 4 cores?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
It seems to me that Intel and AMD should really be focusing on power consumption more than raw-processing. People want a green machine that is powerful, especially quiet (like you point out) and good looking.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
When will the software side catch up to using this many processors?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Both of these systems sounds pretty awesome. They are definately overkill though. I do not know of a single game that would take advantage of 4 cores, let alone 8 &#8211; so what&#039;s the point here from a gaming perspective? Does Photoshop on Vista take advantage of 4 cores?</p>
<p>It seems to me that Intel and AMD should really be focusing on power consumption more than raw-processing. People want a green machine that is powerful, especially quiet (like you point out) and good looking.</p>
<p>When will the software side catch up to using this many processors?</p>
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