Microsoft Should Never Have Built the Xbox

Rob Enderle debates whether it was ever worth it for Microsoft to build the Xbox 360.

I’m having an ongoing debate with a number of folks on whether Microsoft should have ever made the Xbox. I’m arguing against it, and the best argument so far for the Xbox can be found here where there are links to all of the posts so far. What started all of this hullabaloo was a snarky comment I made on Twitter after seeing a chart that showcased that the vast majority of Microsoft’s profit came from Windows and that the Xbox wasn’t contributing much at all to the bottom line. That comment was something to the effect of “Does anyone want to debate Microsoft’s Xbox now?” And evidently a bunch did. Now realize that this is in hindsight and we are doing this for fun, so neither side is using any language that would embarrass our mothers. Still, I feel it’s a debate worth having.

Arguments for the Xbox 360

PRJ, who posted the latest position, argues seven points in favor of why the venture makes sense. I’ll cover each briefly here, but it generally is best to bring up his site and see his original words.

His first point is that PC gaming isn’t going anyplace. MMOs own the space and there really hasn’t been an innovative game for the PC for some time. Even when a game does come out it is buggy and needs significant patching.

His second point, which dovetails to the first, is that the Xbox 360 is Microsoft’s only stable platform. It is too easy for everyone from manufacturers to users to screw up the PC and destroy the gaming experience.

The third point made is that by owning the hardware, Microsoft can assure quality for both the hardware and the game. This guarantees that the game experience is top-notch, and that the system also works for products like the Zune and Windows Extender.

The fourth point presented here is that Microsoft is driving the Xbox 360 into the home as the core product, not Windows or the PC. It is more likely to be in your media cabinet and it does more media functions.

His next and fifth point is that, with the Xbox platform, Microsoft has executed better customer support and satisfaction than it has with Windows. The company has had problems, but addressed them more quickly and effectively then with its Windows line of products.

As for the sixth point, he says that it’s a great platform for developers and much better than the painful PS3 platform or the limited Wii. Investment is minimal and the Xbox Marketplace is effective and successful at moving indie titles.

The seventh point presented is that profit isn’t important, with popularity and market share more crucial. The Xbox 360 sold nearly 5 million units in 2009 and eclipsed the PS3. With Project Natal, it stands poised to dominate gaming with the possible exception of the Wii, which is really a different kind of gaming system with less interesting games for heavy game players.

In short, Microsoft stands alone when it comes to providing amazing games like Halo 3 and seamless, solid experiences.

Showing 76 comments

  1. RobIsAShill at 7:12am 1st March 2010 Did the M$ shill checks stop rolling in, Robby?
  2. alex c at 3:53am 1st March 2010 i have something for you , feel the love…. real news./…..here wweee goooo

    obv resistance 3 is comin, killzone 3 is comming… n

    1…ssx – ps3 exclusive o dere…the best game in the world epic epic savage gameplay wiked game

    2…ace combat 7 – ps3 exclusive – afetr xbox paying namco for 6 exclusive, and all the framework for xbox, 7 is completely re-done for ps3 bluray tech.

    3…the mark or kri – check youtube for footage of the first
    ps3 exclusive obv….. ahha keeps getting better

    4… twisted metal 5. check youtube again, for number 4, or the ps2 vrsions, but the psone versions were the classics.

    5…grantheft auto 5, ps3 exclusive, 2 or 3 weeks till unveiling
    not long to go people

    6. AGENT – need i say more>? wel, actually , i cant say more, as this is the most secretive ps3 exclusive ever. or infact any game, ever, there is nothing on this game, and i bet thats jus how rockstarr want it. those sik scottish basterds.. kill it every time, they cant fail.. people like siknes

    7. motorstorm 3. ps3 exclusive…getting tired yet>?

    8. modnation racers, june 1st release… yes….ps3 exclusi…

    9. do you need a number 9>? afer all that..really..

    ok

    syphon filter 5, ps3 exclusive

    naughty dogs immense uncharted 3 is a surefire fact

    and to finish infamous 2,…….

    okay one more ‘the last guardian’ and ico collosus double pack

    that makes 12, one a month my babies,,,,start saving,,, ps3’s got you covered.

    peace . …out…..follow twitter mrpurple101
  3. Allan at 6:44pm 28th February 2010 I really can't see how point 3 could be considered valid. The Xbox 360 has around a 50% failure rate - ie. half of all the consoles sold fail, often with the red ring of death. Even after they are fixed, many of them fail again later on.

    This is not what I'd consider to be good QA for their hardware. It's more like a fundamental design flaw that the designers either didn't spot or couldn't fix.
  4. DCBronco at 3:23pm 26th February 2010 The reason it was a good choice for MS was because the console market is growing. At a cost to the PC market. Developers would prefer a steady platform with known variables to to constantly changing PC world where you have to worry about a thousand different parts. AMD and Nvidia are both struggling to keep up the top card model where it is stave or thrive, never a middle ground. Somebody is the winner and somebody loses, not everyone is prospering. Nintendo is doing extremely well. MS is doing great and Sony is about to turn the corner, maybe. In graphics cards it's always one dominant company and the other(s) hanging on for dear life.

    MS did a lot of market research and focus groups before launching GfW. Time and again the word came back that PC gamers would not pay for things that had been free to them for years. Throw in piracy and the ability for anyone with the know how to make free updates and where is the platform holder. Look at Falcon 4.0, how old is the core game and what company that generates an income updates it. In fact, who is the platform holder. With the PC, the holder is all of the people that make the parts. None of which receives royalties. And no developer is paying MS anything to make a game on their OS. With Xbox, everyone pays $10 per game just to be on the system. Everyone pays for the right to play multi-player online. You can be the publisher for the sure fire hit, wave or half the royalty, provide the advertising budget or pay part of the development cost to a dev to gain exclusivity. Or loan the dev money for exclusivity.

    Once consoles move to a direct download model, they will own every part of the games movement. The game, the ability to re-sell, the DLC. No more Gamestop or online exchanges., the game is tied to a specific account and only that user can use that copy. He will have the right to download again and again so that he doesn't have to worry about having a physical copy. This will lead to millions more in sales. And since the 360 design is basically a PC, what if they allowed PC owners to devlop mods that would then be ported to the Xbox with XNA. And sold as DLC for a share of that money. You can't force a share with a PC mod.

    The PC is wide open and there is no guaranteed control for any company. Consoles are closed and you can develop ways to assure that you get a piece of everything sold for it. When you own the parts of your console, you can make sure that the architecture follows a certain path which guarantees backward comparability.

    Imagine a $100 360 two years from now that can act as a mod kit for a new Xbox console that consist of a modified Xenon and Xenos. Mods submitted to MS for approval and then placed on Live. It seems to be their thinking. XNA Indie games appear on Live. Make those tools more robust and there will be a PC like mod community on the XBox. MS made the right decision for them. Consoles are where the money is because of control and royalties. And when someone buys a console you know it's for games. When someone buys a PC, it could be for 10 other reasons.
  5. SWKerr at 1:53pm 26th February 2010 Microsoft is sitting on more capital than they can invest at this point. The decision it to return it to investors on invest it into additional product line. There is only so much additional investment in R&D they can do with Windows and Office and get additional returns. (They already own the market.) The investment in the Xbox was a belief they could make a reasonable return for their shareholders above and beyond what is available in the market. The better then average return assumption would have come from the ability to leverage existing Infrastructure, Marketing and Talent pool as compared to any possible competitor. When Microsoft started this adventure Nintendo and Sony had already proved there was a good market for console gaming. PC gaming was already a casualty of this trend.

    PC gaming is not for the masses. You need expensive hardware and computer know how well beyond the average consumer. PC can be better but not to the point where a casual gamer would care.

    Microsoft never abandoned PC gaming or under invested in it. It invested at the level to justify the expected return. It also invested in the console market with an expected return.

    You can fault Microsoft's execution if you want but probably not their reasoning for want to get into a profitable market segment. Fact is they have a lot of capital to invest and diversifying their revenue stream makes perfect sense as long as those investments on average will pay off in reasonable profits.
  6. DCBronco at 9:10am 26th February 2010 I can see I have to be really direct and can't be sarcastic with you. And you question my comprehension ability. MS studies were fallacious? And you use Steam as proof. Then tell me how much it is for a Steam account. Do they make over a billion in subscription fees or is it free. Do any of the digital download services for the PC use a subscription based account model. If so, name them. Besides subscription fees to actually play MMOs, name another subscription based model for PCs. And remember that MMOs will soon appear on consoles. And if you can get someone to pay 12,000 for a dev kit, how is that bad for the console maker? Your argument is based on it being better for the individual. I'm all for that. But the companies involved are companies, and they want it to be best for them.

    You and obviously the author are missing MS and Sony's point. Your second paragraph is all about how open the PC is. That's not what Sony and MS want. They are like the mob. They want a piece of everything done. If an Indie game is sold to a kid on the corner, they want in. And the way to do that is by controlling the territory, that being the thing it's played on. You can't do that with the PC. Like you said it's the most open. You can with a console, to a certain extent. And that is exactly what they want. And that is where the real money is made. And pirating is far worst on the PC. See, Crysis.

    Where do you get numbers from. Buddy, there are companies for that. Have you ever heard of NPD? There are others. For each region of the world. ChartTrack in Europe. Major corporations use these companies to gauge the success of products in the market place and to help them understand trends. Other companies use them to understand their bargaining position and what products actually move. The console makers release this information each month. Just check the Wall Street Journal. There are also these things called annual reports that each company has to file. Most companies try to hide certain things, like Sony and the cost of the PS3 or MS and the loses of the original Xbox. But these numbers are available to the public(http://www.microsoft.com/msft/reports/default.mspx). This doesn't give actual numbers, but it gives you and idea. http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/23183/Weekly.... Do you really believe Braid is pulling in 10 million a week. And Steam usually sells at bargain prices. And that info is directly from Valve. Here's a article about one of the rare PC games that competes with console sales. And that is always very temporary. http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php.... This one really breaks down the European positions.http://www.mcvuk.com/features/624/UK-Monthly-Charts-December. Like I said, PC doesn't compare. DD or not.

    So your year old machine can play Crysis at how many frames a second? And it does DX11 right? And it can play every game too at the highest setting. I know more than you think. Are you hitting the specs for all of your games or the recommended specs? Are you really playing everything with all of the bells and whistles? I mean 4x AA, 90 frames at 1680x1050? Are you really? I kinda doubt it. And when I mentioned WoW, it was because your current most successful game is NOT a graphical powerhouse. So for all of your talk of graphical power, it doesn't really seem to matter when the money comes in. And you do know that you are comparing your year old PC to a Almost 6 year old console? Compare your 5 year old PC to it. Was that DX10 too. And the next generation of console will only cost $399. Even Sony understands that is the starting point. So once you add DDR5 RAM and a new mid-range Graphics card, it will be behind the new consoles that comes out a year later.

    The new Xbox or PS4(if Sony decides to participate so soon), will be at least DX10 with components of DX11 if not full DX11. It will have 4 Gbs of RAM. It will have a proprietary Graphics card that will be on par with the best available in the PC market at the time of release or better. It will have every water or physics or lighting that will be available at that time and it might even be upgradable. It will have a large HD for DD, since it is being called for by the devs to cut off re-sellers like Gamestop(http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123249378212700025.html) or DLC will be attached to accounts linked to your Live account like on ME2. That will add billions to the devs sales.

    Your problem is that you're stuck in the past. What you believe was once true. Read some recent news. Read some annual reports. Look at how the Entertainment and Devices Division of MS that contains the Xbox made a profit last fiscal year despite the fact that it contains many items that are nothing but a money drain. Things like Zune(which should have changes recently), Surface, Internet TV and advertising for Mac Office(how'd that get in there, especially at over 400 million some years with none of the resulting profits from that product coming back to the division). How about the R & D for all of those none income generating products.Or for products like Natal. I actually read things like that and know a little bit about where those numbers come from. They are released constantly. I still have a lot to learn about them. I may not be the genius that your are(that's called sarcasm, not trolling), but I do know a little bit about this stuff. So just keep clicking those heels and repeating that PC games rule the roost, and one day your dreams may come true.
  7. darren at 8:46am 26th February 2010 Nice article. Maybe i am mistaken, but I think a lot of people are missing the point of this article. I am fairly certain the author would agree that gamers are glad the 360 is here, but was it a good choice for microsoft, in comparison to focusing on another market where they stood to make a great deal more money. I own both a ps3 and 360 and I am glad I do. No doubt i am glad microsoft built the 360, but the debate is whether it was a wise business decision for them. just because it may have made our gaming lives better (adding competition), doesnt mean it was better for microsoft and its stockholders.
  8. dreamhunk at 6:02am 26th February 2010 here this link will tell you why this generation of consoles is so long enough said!

    http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2009/05/e3-predic...
  9. dreamhunk at 5:57am 26th February 2010 Pc gaming as never dead! The ehole pc gaming was garbage was made because of sony and microsoft. Yea them consoles are so great that 11 000 console game devs have now gone bankuprt because of pircay,rented games,,used game market and high production costs. Yea consoles are so great when both sony and microsoft have lost billions on consoles. The reason your having a longer console generation is because sony and mircosoft have lost billions on consoles.

    http://adrianwerner.wordpress.com/games-of-2010/

    what a dumb statment pc gaming will never die,, why because there are millions of game devs making games for the pc.
  10. bob at 4:58am 26th February 2010 Yeah, WoW is doing great. and in fact it probably accounts for a huge percent of all PC gaming revenue. PC gaming use to be vibrant and full of big titles...now there is WoW and....well not a lot. WoW has kept the PC gaming revenue up, but it hides the fact that there are fewer games making real $$. As the author summerized "MMOs own the space and there really hasn’t been an innovative game for the PC for some time.". Exactly. Think of PC gaming without MMOs and what do you have? Not a lot.
  11. Sircapsalock at 11:46pm 25th February 2010 I completely agree with what is said above.
    I own wii and xbox. xbox is broken and not consistent, it is not reliable.

    Don't want to pay for something that is free elsewhere, I'd have PSN rather than a subscription based xboxLive. No matter how good Xbox live is, you can get that same service on your PC for free. Not to mention playing games online requires a harddrive, which is free with the ps3, but overpriced in a 360.

    From what I saw on the PSN network there doesn't seem to be much missing from the experience, what is it about the PSN network that's "painful"?
    The wii system online is painful; very, very painful (lag). But even then you could work around other shortcomings.

    The xbox services are nice, but not worth extra money.
  12. Brian Murphy at 9:40pm 25th February 2010 Then MS' studies were fallacious then, weren't they, given the success and obvious thriving that we're seeing happen with Steam? Right? Not to mention other digital distribution methods, akin to Steam but not nearly as large. As I stated before, only a 3rd of PC sales happen at retail outlets. The rest is online distribution. Which, of course, blows a hole in your theories that PC users won't pay for things. PC users certainly will pay for services, as I said, that offer a value better than the competition. And, with the author's article in mind, it seems quite obvious that the same amount of time and effort spent on XBL, and applying it to GfW, would result in a vastly higher return.

    As for free stuff in their garages, you're absolutely right, there's a ton of free IP out there for people on PC. There's also a virtual cornucopia of tiny to large games out there. The reason being, it doesn't cost a couple thousand dollars for a dev kit for a PC. Because you have the dev kit, when you have a PC. In that regard, the PC is the most open and versatile system to utilize for small developers, as it hits the biggest audience possible, for the least amount of money. Whereas, with the 360/PS3/Wii they have to purchase the dev kits, and then work their way through Sony/MS' red-tape to get the game onto the PSN/XBL. All that costs money to a tiny developer. So, while creating a closed GfW system would probably result in some kind of fee of use from MS, the tiny devs would still be able to dodge the costs of the dev kits for consoles.

    Now, PC games never hit console levels, really? You have this data? Where? I'd really like to see it, because currently, there's not a single entity on this planet, that tracks every digital/retail sale of PC games. There are just too many outlets that control their statistical data (sort of like tracking PSN sales...can't do it without getting Sony's data...ain't happening, likewise with XBLA...they only really announce milestones, not weekly statistics in numbers people can track), the only real source we can get (but still, not 100% itemized), is the pc gaming alliance, which states PC Gaming was a 12.7 billion dollar industry in 2008. Console gaming wished it was that big in 2008.

    Now, I'm going to suggest you stop right where you are with your comments on graphics cards and upgrading PC's, because you are clearly, not knowledgeable about such this. Needless to say, this PC I have right now, was built January of 2009. And since I actually have motivation and intelligence to research my purchase, I actually put together a machine that will be quite competitive for some time to come. I won't need a new part for at least another year. And even then, the price for upgrade is miniscule compared to what's needed for swapping to a new console. (Think about it, sure, my GPU was $290 when I bought it, but since then, it's come down 70, in another year it'll be below 200, the next gen of consoles will most certainly cost more than that, and have nowhere near the horsepower of my pc, still).

    Now, what's with the idiotic and obvious attempt at trolling with the WoW comment? You can't be that stupid as to think WoW has anything graphically, that'd be like Valve claiming their Half-life Engine that they won't put a bullet in, is still competitive. Seriously, you're not that dumb, are you? Because, you know, I clearly said that your 'Mass Effects' hit PC...are you insinuating somehow that Mass Effect has WoW-like graphics? Because, no, that just doesn't add up. How about this though, ever see a game in DX10 on your 360. No, you haven't.

    I however, have volumetric water, physx, every form of lighting you can possibly imagine, FSAA up to 16x, and I run most DX10 games in excess of 100fps, and I rarely ever...ever...have loading screens. What's so great about all that? Because it tells me, for todays set of games, and for the foreseeable future, my PC is far far superior to current needs. Meaning, it'll stay relevant allot longer than current consoles, and be cheaper to upgrade than it will be to buy into a whole new generation of consoles whenever the 720 or whatever comes out.

    PC Gaming's not even close to dead, you're just too complacent about your ignorance to actually look into real statistical data that isn't spoon-fed to you buy the console makers. It's just amusing how many people just like you are out there, who think they know what they're talking about, but really just don't know squat, because all they do is read one headline, then take regurgitate it verbatim, like it's facts. Yeah, fyi, just cause you read it on the internet, doesn't make it so. Try double-checking your sources from time to time, and maybe, just maybe, you won't come to discussions such as these, with so very many unsubstantiated claims.
  13. msuciman1234 at 9:31pm 25th February 2010 Investment is minimal and the Xbox Marketplace is effective and successful at moving indie titles plus, we don't have to make those really real looking outfits that they get at playstation Home.
  14. DCBronco at 8:58pm 25th February 2010 Brian maybe you're just uninformed or stupid. MS wanted to charge for GfWs but studies showed that PC gamers are unwilling to pay for the infrastructure. That also goes for DLC and things like that. Maybe you hadn't noticed all of the free stuff available made by people in their garages. Why would anyone pay. That's the reason for a closed platform. Sorry, didn't realize you needed spoon feeding on pretty common knowledge.

    Some PC gamers, like you, are delusional. PC game sales never hit console levels. Most of the money made on PC games is from WOW. While consoles have several games each year that hit the 5 million sold mark, PC games rarely have a title come close to that nowadays. And the numbers are falling. And speaking of WOW, is that one of those graphical powerhouses you were speaking of? You're part of that 30% that cares that much. And since technology has moved so far ahead of what it was, the next generation of consoles will have more than enough power to make the graphics well enough for 85% of the public. Eventually there won't be anywhere to go graphically. Most people would prefer to have a console that is stable and you know you'll be able to play that new game instead of the upgrade your graphics card game every 6 months. And games appearing on the PC means that MS is just hitting more money while still having their console advantage over Sony.

    Just get over the PC gaming thing. Let it die with some dignity.
  15. Brian Murphy at 7:59pm 25th February 2010 Congratulations, simple reading comprehension eludes you? Point out where I said GfW currently has a paid subscription model. Find it? Thought not.

    Obviously, I was stating that if Microsoft had invested the same amount of time and effort into GfW that they have XBL, they would have a robust closed network, capable of offering a great great many bits/pieces of DLC etc.. basically everything that's offered on XBL now, but on PC. Which has, as I stated, a vastly, vastly higher install base. Ooh, 1 billion for XBL gold subscriptions? Try 228 million x $15 x 12/mo. I'm pretty sure that annihilates any number you can come up with.

    As I said, it's about what would've made MS more money, clearly Games for Windows is a better option (as it also helps reinforce Windows Vista/7 sales), rather than taking away from them. Think about it, DX10-11 is only capable on Vista+ OS'. The 360 can't even do it. So, there's a ridiculous amount of gaming tech, being purposefully ignored...just so MS can make...less money?

    As for Sony's internal devs? Um, they've had them for a hell of alot longer than MS has been in the console race. SCEA/SCEE/SCEJ have been making games for over a decade. None of which, ever have a chance of showing up on my PC, whereas, your 'Mass Effects' are, and will always...always, look, perform, and control better on my PC. (Most kids can't afford a gaming PC, I, however, am not a kid, nor is a self-built $2300 machine out of my price range). Of course, your whole argument there is pretty pointless, console makers have internal devs for 1 reason, and 1 reason only. To give you a reason to buy their console. Problem is, Microsoft keeps letting their '360 exclusives' hit PC half a year later, and most people have begun to realize this by now. To say nothing of the 360's chances of ever being able to claim 'exclusivity' and have it be believed.
  16. DCBronco at 7:57pm 25th February 2010 Too many people are living in Sony's past. The games division hasn't made a profit for Sony since 2005 or 06. Like Bob said, the PS3 has eaten all of the profits from the PS2 and though it is starting to break even in parts cost, it still has other cost too. MS is making enough off of the console itself to offset all of their cost. You also have to take into account that Sony's other division have been failing also. Well most of them and Sony lost over a billion last year as a company. Even during their best years they made 3-4 billion on a year. For MS, that's a quarter.

    Natal should help MS boost their lead too. The other thing about Sony starting to break even on the PS3 cost is that it's too little, too late. We will most likely see new consoles next year or the year after. That would relegate the PS3 to budget console status and it will be sold at break even prices again and competing with a Natal equipped 360. And that will also kill off the PS2. And Sony would have to release a new console and they have to realize that it needs to be $399 at launch. If they don't, MS brings out a far superior Xbox(than the PS3) that is backwards compatible and priced at $399 that will force them to budget price the PS3 just to move it. Realistically if anyone should be considering leaving the gaming business as a console manufacturer, it's Sony.
  17. DCBronco at 7:40pm 25th February 2010 GfW doesn't make subscription fees for MS. If the 23 million gold number are right, that's over a billion there alone. And regardless of how many game ready PCs are sold, there are no guarantees. Consoles are a sure thing and there is money for MS no matter from royalties and console sales. With no royalties on the PC, PC owners unwilling to pay for live and the best DLC usually mods, MS loses out on a lot of potential money. On top of that they can still cut out most of their first-party publishers and pay or loan developers for the exclusives they need. Which is far more efficient than Sony's idea of buying 10 companies. MS doesn't get stuck with any more Perfect Dark Zeros, but they get more Mass Effects.
  18. maddan at 7:02pm 25th February 2010 The dreaded "rings of red" Error 73 !!!! arrggh why make something that's guaranteed to fail after only a few months or years..ohh that's right we like to compete with others even on "failing"....okay Toyota we got ya beat and Microsoft's Chairman will never apoligize...everybody go back to what you do best..America make cars....Japan video game systems...just kidding..but it really would be nice to invest as a consumer in something that doesn't have the " lazy man get it to the market quick and fix it later" factor...
  19. Brian Murphy at 5:49pm 25th February 2010 It's quite simple, the DLC, addons, map packs, costume packs etc... would all be supported and delivered via GfW, which is really just XBL on PC. It's virtually the same system already, honestly. Gamertags even carry over..., the point is that by holding back their PC division (which, let's be honest, has a horrendous headstart over the consoles), they ended up making less money in the long run. There is no way anyone can argue the profit gains possible on PC versus Console. There are just too many PC's out there. Remember, we're talking 228 Million (Circa 2008) versus what, 38-39 million 360's?

    But yeah, if Microsoft had worked towards making PC gaming more attractive to the public, think about how far the Games for Windows service could've come by now. As I said, I think they probably would've done better, simply because PC's are already a mainstay in households, and creating a closed, controllable network like that (that people will pay for..), well, we're talking easily the kind of money WoW pulls in monthly for Activision/Blizzard.
  20. space invader at 4:41pm 25th February 2010 how pointless this is, the xbox is made fact ive spent hours of enjoyment on mine (i have a ps3 and a gameing computer) so im not just an xbox fanboy.If you dont like xbox then dont buy one.Yes if it had a blu ray player it would control the market but it does not people cant read the future its just like beta max and the vhs war back in the 80's yes im that old it would be better for everyone if they could all get together and make one perfect console but that will never happen un fortunatly.thats my view for what its worth peace the space invader.
  21. Danny93 at 3:50pm 25th February 2010 Well, the first Xbox was ok, but i would 100% agree that the Xbox 360 shouldn't have been made, or at least waited to come out. Microsoft decided to rush the 360, knowing they cant compete with the juggernauts of Nintendo and Especially Sony and PlayStation 3. Right now there is a higher install base for PS3 in North America, and PS3 seems to have this year in their hands, with PS3 slim out, and all there great games coming out, and premium PSN service, Home updates, and more. One major reason i feel the 360 shouldn't have been made is because of its faulty hardware, and how limited it is, not only in performance and limitations, but also the restrictions and regulations Microsoft put on 360 like the multiple discs fee, patches smaller than a certain size, and mandated paid DLC if any planned put on their service, must pay online service, and much more. Sure competition is good, but when you pay everyone, and hold everyone back, and have only 5 true exclusives, and make games get dumbed down to meet the 360 standards on other consoles like PS3, with the biggest example recently being Lost Planet 2, where content cuts were made on PS3 when it can obviously fit the game entire, like 4 times on one disc, but no the PS3 has to be identical to the inferior 360. 360 has not really revolutionized any huge concepts, besides certain things live has brought to consoles, like friend lists and community. Sony has never failed to impress and always actually get better each next generation. The 360 should of waited to release, and needs a major upgrade in hardware as it is seen now, but its to late to really help it, the next console seems like its going to come out next year. Also, Microsoft has never made no profit of the 360, and has lost so much money its actually pretty funny that they still continue.
  22. dang at 3:32pm 25th February 2010 Points for throwing Dreamcast in there. :)
  23. bob at 3:24pm 25th February 2010 Not sure where you are getting your facts, but the 360 probably has a better line-up of exclusive this year than the PS3. Splinter Cell Conviction, Halo Reach, Alan Wake, Fable 3, ME2, Crackdown 2, Perhaps a Gears of War 3, to just name a few bigger ones.

    and the last 5 months? So what--the last 12 months before that the 360 outsold the PS3. These things shift. The PS3 is as far behind the 360 as it was when it launched--and really outside of Japan, they are farther behind than when they started.

    MS doens't wish they had never built the thing--Sony fans wish they hadn't so that the PS brand might not have went from dominant to 3rd place in a single generation while costing Sony over $6B. The PS3 has been a collosal failure for Sony and there is no end in sight.
  24. bob at 3:19pm 25th February 2010 Except you haven't explained how they would make the same kinds of money. They royalties for games published on xbox. They don't for games published for windows. They could have spent that money and not really have anything to show for it as there wouldn't be any revenue streams!
  25. bob at 3:17pm 25th February 2010 You do realize that the PS3 has cost Sony more than the xbox and teh xbox360 has cost MS--COMBINED? You also realize that the losses from the PS3 has negated all the profits from the PSP, PS2, and is now eating into the PS1 profits? You realize that the 360 has been profitable for 2 years for MS and looks like it will continue to be, and even probably increasing over time as the installed base grows?
  26. David Macphail at 3:12pm 25th February 2010 Well the 360 constantly gets outsold by the Wii and PS3 every week and has done for the past 5 months, with no signs of it changing anytime soon. Also, considering the 360 barely has a single exclusive lined up for 2010, it seems things are only going to get worse for Microsoft. Especially with most people expecting Natal to fall flat on it's face compared to the far superior Wiimote/Arc controllers.

    When you see your console constantly coming in last every single week in hardware sales.........you couldn't blame Microsoft for wishing they'd never built the darn thing. The 360 is basically what you get if you cross a Sega Dreamcast with a hilariously high failure rate and then forget to release any exclusive games for it.
  27. Brian Murphy at 3:10pm 25th February 2010 While I agree that the Xbox business model has worked well for Microsoft, in fact, noone's denying they've made money from their console. What's being questioned here is, whether the console has been more lucrative to them, than say focusing that effort/money/r&d into their already very well established PC gaming base. Plainly put, the are more PC's capable of playing games out there, than the Wii+360+PS3 combined. (228 Million desktops and laptops in 2008, projected to grow to 600 million by 2013)

    With those figures, and given Microsoft's domination in the OS market, they already have a monopoly on the largest gaming base in the world (PC Gaming made 12.7 billion in 2008), so, had Microsoft not completely abandoned the GfW network, in favor of XBL...isn't it possible that they'd be making more money and games, through GfW? The answer's obviously yes.

    Still, MS has made money, and made some pretty stiff competition for Sony. But, as a PC Gamer first, and PS3 gamer 2nd. I particularly wish they'd stayed outta the console business. While I will wait for games like GTAIV, CoD, Prototype, Dragon Age etc... for PC, it's annoying that MS takes such great efforts to temporarily block me access to their games. When you've got badass gaming rig...there's really no point to getting a 360.
  28. David Macphail at 3:06pm 25th February 2010 Except PS3 hardware is nearing the break - even point and Sony are making enough income from software sales to offset the loss they take on hardware.

    Also, unlike Microsoft, Sony's games division actually CONTRIBUTES to their income margins. Microsoft's income comes from Windows and it's a good thing too, had Microsoft relied as heavily on their games division as Sony and Nintendo do, they would've gone bankrupt long ago. The original Xbox was a disaster for Microsoft - it lost them $4 billion and the 360 hasn't done a whole lot better. OK, they've penetrated a larger share of the market, however they still lost MORE billions on the RROD fiasco.
  29. Ian Bell at 3:01pm 25th February 2010 Cool. Nice to see someone else posting on here with more than an ounce of intelligence haha.
  30. Brian Murphy at 2:59pm 25th February 2010 Yeah I was agreeing with you, simply adding more data to the discussion =)
  31. David Macphail at 2:57pm 25th February 2010 I love it when 360 gayboys make complete idiots out of themselves infront of the entire Internet. If 360 games are so good sales - wise then would you mind explaining why no 360 exclusive franchise has ever or will ever come close to Gran Turismo's 55 million?

    I love it when exclusive games sell upwards of 15 million, oh wait, no 360 game ever has because they're all crap with terrible graphics. 360 fanboys need to accept the blame here - you idiots obviously aren't buying any 360 games when they come out, so why should Microsoft keep making them?
  32. David Macphail at 2:50pm 25th February 2010 Uh - oh!!! Looks like the 360 spastic patrol is on here to shed some serious fanboy tears, LOL.
  33. nou at 2:06pm 25th February 2010 I own all systems and I don't agree.

    PSN is superior to XBL.

    From my experience in the hardcore gaming community on the PC, dedicated servers will always be superior. Which 360 doesn't deliver.

    360 just doesn't deliver anything more than a casual gaming experience directed at people for all ages and all sorts of gamers and just doesn't satisfy my needs as a hardcore PC gamer.

    I don't want lag, I don't want to have to pay for something that's free elsewhere, I do not want my experience simplified for casuals either.

    PSN delivers more than XBL for me, and PS3 is superior as a multimedia device too.


    I found the person that was defending the 360 in this article biased, he talks as though PC games aren't going any where... but where has the 360 gone? Almost every single one of their "exclusives" are superior on the PC.
  34. DCBronco at 2:00pm 25th February 2010 Wasn't Microsoft's reason for moving into the console market the fact that console revenue is rising. Some estimate by as much as 170% over a ten year period. And PC gaming is falling. Microsoft made two big mistakes that have hurt the Xbox.

    1. was not owning the hardware on the first Xbox.
    2. RRoD.

    Take away those two things and the Xbox has been profitable for years. Take away RRoD and the 360 would most likely have sold 15-20% more units. And since when does any company come into a totally new market and not take losses to establish themselves. If gaming does turn into a 60billion a year business and MS can claim even a third, it will boost the revenue of an already extremely profitable company by a third.

    Also, if the amount of money you believe MS is losing is enough for it to be a mistake for them(and they have far more than Sony), then considering the PS3 has lost close to 6Billion, shouldn't they be leaving the VG business.
  35. Brian25 at 1:22pm 25th February 2010 They could control the hardware though, they could either release a set of systems designed for this type of gaming or just place a set of minimum specs for running the games and if people don't have a quick enough system then they would have to upgrade. But the main pro is that people wouldn't have to invest in a computer and console rather just a computer that could play games like a console and perform general computing tasks as well. Would be nice for consumers but publishers may not like it.
  36. Ian Bell at 1:02pm 25th February 2010 Brian,

    Were you replying to me or the person above me. I am agree with you 100%, I was telling him he was wrong as well.
  37. Grumpy Indian Dude at 1:00pm 25th February 2010 I love my PS3 and my PC. I don't own a 360 but this competition is good for the industry. MS saw the oppotunity and they took advantage of it, and I congratulate them. They are trying to expand their market, just as they got into smartphones etc... It's how business works. I just hope one day Halo will come to PS3 :-)
  38. tfyhfr at 12:17pm 25th February 2010 microsoft has made so much money of the xbox 360 whether from people buying the 360 or all the repairs that they have done and all the games they have sold. but the 360 was not ready to be releases when they released it. they screwed me and alot of people over with the stupid red rings and the 100 dollar repair fee.
  39. Brian Murphy at 11:42am 25th February 2010 It's kind of stupid to say that PC gaming is on it's last legs. It's been widely reported on, that NPD only tracks retail sales, and that PC Gaming has shifted from retail to online distribution quite severely. I believe the number is 1/3rd of all PC gaming purchases are done via retail. Now, as many may have noticed from simply going to their favorite gaming stores, retailers are cutting down on PC space dramatically. Best Buy, EBGames, Gamestop etc... they've all reduced or in some cases entirely eliminated their PC displays.


    Again, this feeds the misconception that PC gaming is on the decline, one simply needs to peruse the PCGA's website (PC Gaming Alliance), to get some real numbers regarding the health of the PC Market.

    http://www.pcgamingalliance.org/

    I definitely agree after reading this article, that from a monetary standpoint, Microsoft's more lucrative option would've been to apply the monies and knowledge into Games for Windows, building a far more robust GfW system, and ultimately creating a vastly more popular and stable closed-network than Steam currently enjoys. Not to mention the monopoly they'd have with GfW royalties et al.
  40. dang at 11:26am 25th February 2010 This currently up to the game publisher. If you look at Bioshock 2 for example. They create the initial game, then port it to the other console and PCs.

    I can't imagine why Microsoft would ever do this. They don't control hardware on the PC. That's one of the biggest challenges for games on the PC is testing all the different hardware combinations that might exist.
  41. Ian Bell at 11:22am 25th February 2010 It's always about profit with a company.
  42. Brian25 at 11:22am 25th February 2010 I love the idea of giving the consumer the ability to port console games straight to their windows pc. That would be a great next step for Microsoft. They could still make consoles for people who don't want to invest more into a PC capable of high-end gaming. They could also market more expensive PCs for people who want dual use out them for general computer use and gaming.
  43. Alan at 10:55am 25th February 2010 Microsoft built the Xbox to get Windows/Live/insertMicrosoftBrandHere into the living room. They saw Sony taking it over and new they needed to compete. It was never about profit or games.
  44. Anon2 at 10:38am 25th February 2010 Wow your dumb.
  45. Titan at 10:20am 25th February 2010 HOT GOD OF WAR III CHICK

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXUDTnoXYXE
  46. jay at 10:15am 25th February 2010 If you own both consoles and don't accept the fact that live is better than PSN and that PS3 has a better hardware, you are the fanboy. I own both consoles and both are great and both have also deficiencies.
    I think they los millions intead of doing billions to make trillions in the future, they are trying to get into your house and have a media center conected to your tv so you start using Silverlight more and more and they would love to dominate that. The same way PS3 has blue ray and Sony will make much more money with the movies than with the PS3 it self, so who cares if I lose 3.8 billion dollars on the PS3 if I'll own the new standard movie format that 5 years from now will represent maybe 5 billion a year. Blu Ray won thank to PS3 and MS is trying to get streaming content and downloadable content the next format trough the xbox.
    Cheers
  47. Ian Bell at 9:33am 25th February 2010 Not sure the PC Gaming market is on it's last legs. Take a look at World of Warcraft, and a number of other games that thrive on the PC.
  48. Kimball Brown at 9:15am 25th February 2010 The PC OEMs are having a tough enough time making any money, and the XBox ruined a high end, high profit SKU for them. Microsoft should never have entered this space.
  49. Scott S at 8:54am 25th February 2010 Not sure I agree with the arguments here, but definitely seems a strange move to have shifted focus from Windows gaming where the company already enjoys a massive market share. Wish it was possible to find a happy medium, as PC gaming has since fractured, and seems to be gaining more traction in the Web browser than it has on a dedicated system...
  50. wanderson75 at 8:42am 25th February 2010 I think another aspect that you're missing with your arguments is the third party support for gaming, and the declining profitability in PC gaming.

    Microsoft has been working for years with third party vendors to get gaming support, but the market for PC gaming is significantly smaller than the console market. Those third party vendors are taking a hard look at the PC and wondering if it's really worth spending the millions of dollars needed to make a top notch PC game. And even if they take the plunge, they aren't going to make nearly as much money as they would with a console.

    The very smart move that Microsoft made with the 360 is in the development tools. Third party devs can make a game for the 360, and fairly easily port it over to the PC if they feel they want to. This lowers the cost of having to develop for one platform, and increases profitability for the third party.

    Another smart move that Microsoft has made is in the media integration. By integrating with a Home Theatre PC equipped with Windows Media Player, as well as the Zune Software, you can now stream TV content (from a TV card in the PC), Music, Pictures, Movies and TV shows in Hi-Def (From the Zune Service) to make it a really complete experience.

    I personally subscribe to both the Zune and Xbox Live services. And I've started purchasing most of my TV shows direct from Zune, and getting movies (In DVD) that include Digital Downloads. I've gotten to the point where I've started to consider nixing my cable bill because frankly, I don't watch cable TV anymore. And the relative cost of my TV shows is about $40 a month purchasing points through Zune or XBL.

    The addition of Last.fm, Twitter, and Facebook have brought the console closer to being a social device over the web. And while I think there are significant improvements to be made with the social aspect of the Xbox, I believe they're headed in the right direction.

    Microsoft took a black eye when they nixed support for the original Xbox so quick after it came out, and I think that Microsoft is paying for that dearly with the 360. However, I think that the 360 is proving that Microsoft can in fact put out a quality product. I think that their next gen console, whenever it comes out, will move to profitability far quicker than the 360 because of the reputation that Microsoft is rebuilding with this current gen of consoles.
  51. dorkus at 8:41am 25th February 2010 When a company like Microsoft has a PROFIT that is larger than the ENTIRE gaming industry's worth (gaming industry was worth $22billion in 2008) of course the Xbox would seem minuscule.

    And don't forget, "Entertainment and Devices" includes not only the Xbox but also WinMo and Zune, which aren't exactly money-makers right now. (I know Zune is losing money, not sure about WinMo, so that is pulling those profit number down)
  52. Dirk at 8:02am 25th February 2010 It's about control of the ecosystem. Because Microsoft controls the 360 ecosystem they can charge developers who want to play in there ecosystem with royalties and consumers with higher prices. There is no way they could do the same thing with the PC since they didn't create it. What isn't necessarily considered in either argument is the fact that people who bought the 360 are still buying Windows so what has Microsoft have now? People buying both products because they need or want to. Sounds like a smart move to me to have marketshare and mindshare in both ecosystems if you can pull it off.
  53. Bob at 7:31am 25th February 2010 Oh--yeah--about PC gaming. If you look at console gaming 10 years ago--how many were on the PC. How many now? From my perspective it definitely looks like a lot more consoles games are making it to the PC, and also the other way. So that seems like a good thing--and I think a lot of that can be attributed to MS and their efforts for developing tools to ease those ports. So in a very real way they have helped PC gaming.
  54. mandoca at 7:29am 25th February 2010 I love when ps3 fanboys use articles to vent out their frustrations. I cant imagine the game industry without day one million selling exclusives. Ohh i forgot sony doesnt have that.
  55. Agent75 at 7:28am 25th February 2010 The way I see it is if you want to play games made/published by Microsoft, you have to buy their console, the same as if you want to play Nintendo games. I'm glad Microsoft made the Xbox 360 as it's my fave console, it's a lot better than the original Xbox, and I don't think the high price of a PC is worth the money. The biggest fault of all is all the design faults with the Xbox 360, so that's the only gripe I have. Looking at the whole faults fiasco, I wish the Xbox 360 was made by a more reliable electronics company. I know Microsoft made a loss on the original Xbox, and it sounds like they're out of pocket with the Xbox 360, so obviously they need a masterplan to with their next console if there is one.
  56. TheGreatness at 7:07am 25th February 2010 If only your dad had worn a condom 9 months before you were born...
  57. bob at 6:35am 25th February 2010 They definitely should have done the xbox. Why:
    1) Sony was making bold claims of "winning the living room" and making it where people didn't need to own a home computer. This strikes right to the heart of MS--Windows. One of xbox's goals was to protect Windows.
    2) Their markets are largely tapped out--Windows can't grow--it is 95% already. Gaming is $20B or more market--go for that.
    3) Putting effort into Window's gaming doesn't really make them much money unless they make the game themselves. COD:MW2 made them ~$10-15 for every copy sold on 360 and $0 for ever copy sold for Windows.
    4) They lost money getting into the market, but are now being profitable.
    5) If they become the dominant console this gen, next gen, or next-next gen, potential profits are in the multi-billions.
    6) xbox/360 also helps windows by being a media center extender.
    7) xbox can very much be a media center all by itself and is very good at it. Music, movies, netflix, gaming, etc.
    8) The opportunity cost is important--but no one has put forth a better thing to do.
    9) The division was losing $1B a year before the xbox ever started, xbox turned division into a profitable one. Saving $1B a year is the same as making it.
  58. shadowspike2010 at 6:31am 25th February 2010 you idiot fanboy microsoft got in it for the profit lost millions it first year and yes could have made billions. oh and I have been waiting since xp. except for cross chat and being able to play music while gaming it is the same thing you just pay yes i have both live and psn and play both regularly get one and see both points and to be honest if they both came out the same time live wouldn't have so many subscribers and psn would that is what make live better more people. we all would like a better windows experience.
  59. Liam at 6:29am 25th February 2010 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    If the box wasn't made, then we most likely would not be enjoying the high quality gaming we are right now.

    1. We all know that competition fosters creativity and innovation. That is what typically sets differences between products and performance.

    Commenting on what the dude above me has posted i'd like to point out that if the Xbox wasn't made wouldn't the competition be just as high and full of innovation and crativity with console vs PC the same as it has been with The Xbox vs PS3 vs Wii? What i mean is that if the money was being put into PC gaming wouldn't the console have a greater struggle competing with PC games especially because PC's can be upgraded with new hardware year by year whereas with the consoles its the same hardware for its 5+ year life period? Surely the gives consoles more of a reason to be competing at a higher level than they would be competing against each other... In my opinion Microsoft has just push its main competitor out of the competition.
  60. jiggyteddy at 5:34am 25th February 2010 I'll admit that I didn't read your article, but just wanted to make some fundamental comments. First off, I'm not a rabid and ignorant fanboy.

    If the box wasn't made, then we most likely would not be enjoying the high quality gaming we are right now.

    No offense, but I find your article title pretty stupid.

    1. We all know that competition fosters creativity and innovation. That is what typically sets differences between products and performance.

    2. You could argue that Microsoft lost a lot of money during this whole process. but guess what? They reap the benefits from the software royalties. Not just that, but if you know anything about business then you would know that it takes money to make money. It takes time. That is business.
  61. lol at 4:27am 25th February 2010 No, what they should have done was develop a more reliable console, stick with first party for new games at least and make LIVE free with an optional premium service.
  62. Mark at 3:53am 25th February 2010 What an utterly retarded question. Maybe Sony should never have made the Playstation or Nintendo anything.
  63. pixelsword at 3:29am 25th February 2010 it's not about competition: it's about breath and rivalry

    Breath because having wider amount of consoles out will increase the chance of success for developers who may not have the money, experience, or time to make a game on X console can make it on Y with better results in respect to their dilemma. Or, if they do have the above, they can make a superior game on X console because Y console does not suit their goals. Furthermore, they can make money off of one console to fund work on another. Rockstar did it, Ninja Theory did it, and so will/are others.

    Rivalry is different than competition: Competition is beating all groups involved in respect to a goal; a rivalry is one group trying to one-up another group. Which is better than competition. Everyone is looking at

    Halo vs. Killzone

    Gran Turismo vs Forza Motorsport

    Gears of War vs. Resistance

    Metal Gear Solid vs. Splinter Cell

    Motorstorm vs DiRT

    MAG vs SOCOM, probably

    ...and so on.

    These games will strive to out-do their rival and will be more focused on completing that task then worrying about the run-of the mill shooter, making it a very splendid environment to grow within.
  64. marty at 2:19am 25th February 2010 Crapbox stable, are you a comic. lol

    RROD says hi

    Crapbox will be remembered for being the most unreliable console ever

    Jump Out, Play B3yond
  65. imapcs at 1:19am 25th February 2010 This site is hilarious! You'll do anything for hits!
  66. Dion at 10:51pm 24th February 2010 One of the few great articles I have seen recently.
  67. Ian Bell at 10:18pm 24th February 2010 I didn't read Robs argument as an either or type situation, just that sales could have been even more if BOTH the PC and Xbox could play games.
  68. Ian Bell at 10:17pm 24th February 2010 http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php...

    Check it out. Microsoft seems to have been struggling with their gaming division. This was posted last year, so no clue whether things have picked up or not.
  69. anyguy at 10:08pm 24th February 2010 microsoft is doing very well for this to be their second console on the market where the competition is alot tougher..its not like when sony came out with psone while the sega saturn and 64 was out they really didnt have competition. sony dominated that gen, then ps2 came and dominated strictly off of prior dominance and im not saying ps2 didnt have the games before words are put in my mouth. dreamcast wasnt a failure sega just messed up with it jus like everything else and gamecube well who cares. xbox 1 started good online console gaming and if not for xbox nobody would care so much for it now. as far as 360 goes everyone copied off of the 360 this gen and are still doing it, microsoft is making profit of of 360's and did it with rrod and countless other problems not to mention everybody hates xbox , ms saw they couldnt controll piracy on the pc so made a console and by the way pc gaming is dead and it has been dead.xbox sales because of is games not like pc which sell because they are computers.
  70. dang at 9:56pm 24th February 2010 Don't forget that cheating is pretty rampant on PC online games.
  71. ano at 9:39pm 24th February 2010 Forgot to add that the strategy of Windows Phone 7, with tightly controlled hardware is not an option that customers want. PC gamers traditionally is used to being able to upgrade and change their hardware at will, which means we are again at square 1.

    PC is an open platform and with it is the bad and the good.
  72. Ano at 9:36pm 24th February 2010 PC gaming was on it's last leg regardless of how much support MS is to provide. Simply put:

    - MS reaps no benefits when a game sold on the PC platform (the OS is frequently pirated)
    - Customers (like me) are sick of upgrading our pc's
    - The console is a different gaming experience than the PC
    - Piracy is rampant on PC both for the OS and the games

    The bottom line, MS could support the PC and become the next Steam or, they could try and invade the living room. I see the living room being the much larger market. If MS continues to push what they have so far, it is no doubt that MS will be in every living room just like the Wii.
  73. James at 9:35pm 24th February 2010 i find this so funny to be honest since your main argument is that they dont make enough profit from the console in order for it to be a sound business plan for microsoft yet i believe in the past year or 2 microsoft's game department has seen a couple of billion profit while sony's has seen a very large loss in terms of money for the past 5-6 years and still continues to lose money on each ps3 while the xbox 360 started making money even after the whole 3 red light issue very early so that means sony should just give up if we go by your arguement.

    microsoft saw a potential in the market that i believe sega left when they stopped making consoles and with such a allready domination in pretty much every other digital market microsoft realised it would be best to join in the game market and i am trully gratefull they have as if you look at what they have achieved in such a short amount of time since joining the game market then you will realise that they have propelled the market into what is now one of the fastest if not the fastest growing markets in the world.
    the xbox 360 i felt was allways going to be held back a bit by the fact that it still runs on the same live that the original xbox ran on but since that will soon no longer be the issue i can see xbox live going beyond the normal online experience and trully becoming something every home would be better off with then without like the home pc is in this modern age.
  74. dominiej at 9:01pm 24th February 2010 And, if I ma add to my argument, Microsoft had to dive into other markets and diversify to avoid monopolistic law suits. Sure, you may think dumping money into a platform that loses money is dumb, but the plan has always been to sell at a loss to gain a foot-hold in the market and then start integrating other platforms and enticing other would-be adopters from other platforms such as my self.

    The PC gaming market is too fragmented with its laundry list of system requirements that leave the gamer's experience potentially decreased by 1) having a lacking system, or 2) having a lesser internet connection to bog down other players. They needed to have interated hardware and software to control the experience. It would be like saying Apple should never have made the iPhone and instead license the OS out to OEMs. Apple would have a Windows Mobile issue.

    OK... that's it... just sayin...
  75. dominiej at 8:46pm 24th February 2010 Yup, we shoulda had only the PS2 and the GameCube duke it out - wait what? That's idiocy - competition, no matter how you slice is ALWAYS better for the consumer. And I totally agree about the XBox Live experience being WAY better than PSN...

    As for the arguments against, you don't make sense. You argue about synergy between platforms, yet that's the goal of MS right now! The whole "Connected Entertainment" vision where Xbox, Zune, and even Windows and WP7S will all integrate tighter and tighter as time goes on. I can tell you from experience, as a Zune owner, now that I see Zune going to the other platforms, I'm going to start hopping onto these other platforms.

    While it may seem it's fragmented (to be honest, it is) at the moment, it has been long known and coming that MS plans to (read: Will) integrate its fragmented ecosystem more and more... Just wait
  76. Sam at 8:08pm 24th February 2010 I like the idea you mention of being able to play Xbox games on a Windows PC. I wonder why Microsoft never thought about doing that? Too many hardware issues you think? If they were able to perfect that strategy, they would likely have grown Windows 7 adoption like you mentioned, hell even increase PC sales.

    You could make a special version of Windows 7 that says "Xbox 360 Certified" or something which means the machine it was installed on met the hardware requirements for playing the games on it. That would have been a genius move.
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